In the beginning Football had no shape; every player would chase the ball with no regard for tactics, formations or even strategies. The sport we have grown to love was about physicality, manliness and couldn’t have been more different from the modern game. Over time a handful of influential coaches changed all this and created Football’s first formation, the 2-3-5. That’s right, just two defenders, three midfielders and an incredible five forwards.
Over time, managers and coaches alike have developed tactics from mere numbers to style, philosophies and strategies. The two man defence of old has now turned into ‘the back four’, the midfield area is generally populated by four to five players as opposed to the old three man system and those five strikers have been cut to just one or two. Despite the attacking appearance portrayed, that 2-3-5 of the past didn’t provide more fluidity than today’s more defensive looking tactics.
Some may suggest that the quantum leap in quality and skill is to thank and that the modern day Footballer is far more equipped in ball control and finishing. A very valid point and certainly one I agree with, but there are bigger reasons for our more defensive looking formations providing more fluid and attractive Football than the 2-3-5. If understood and used correctly my reasoning’s could make us all better Football Managers and open a door that may have been closed to the coaches of old. More importantly, we as gamers can implement a better way of thinking while manufacturing our tactics on Football Manager. This is why I’m writing today, I want to share my thoughts on the modern game and at the end show my result, ‘The Manchelona’.
The deception of modern day formations
OK, to help me explain this I’ll ask you a question. When you hear 4-4-2 and 4-5-1, which formation sounds and feels more defensive? The truth is neither, while most may consider a 4-5-1 in English Football more defensive than the two man attack of a 4-4-2, fans of the Spanish game would loosely call Barcelona’s formation a 4-5-1 and only a mad man could consider their Football defensive. Before I get hounded, yes Barcelona’s formation isn’t officially a 4-5-1 but in essence it is. Guardiola still uses a three man central midfield system (maybe one CM drops a little deeper), he still keeps a flat back four and the lone striker remains as in any 4-5-1 formation. The key difference in shape is that of Guardiola’s wingers. Rather than been in line with the midfield three they push on into a more attacking role.
Now to expand this further yet, I could argue Guardiola’s formation is actually a 2-1-2-2-3…sounds crazy I know, but hear me out. If we look at the attacking movement of each individual player, my proposed formation will start to take shape. The wide defenders are used as wing backs and therefore push on past the half way line during attacking movements. At the same time Guardiola’s wingers move more central to join the lone striker while the two central midfielders move into a more attacking midfield role. My opinion is that Barcelona’s more defensive midfielder, centre backs and goalkeeper are the only players to hold their ground during the attack phase.
What I am trying to say is if you create tactics with one formation in mind, that of which you see in the tactics creation screen, you may be missing out. I have just demonstrated that Barcelona take one shape while defending (the shape you see while creating a tactic,) but then a drastically different shape while attacking (the shape that isn’t invisible while creating tactics.) So while we are looking at one formation within our tactics creation screen, WE control the way these players move within that system, meaning WE control what formation is formed while our little men defend and attack. So my conclusion is that tactics have come a long way since that historic 2-3-5 of old, so far in fact that we see numbers representing a far more defensive formation, but these modern day formations aren’t just one shape, they are many different shapes within one formation formed to cope with each phase of play meaning one formation transforms into another while a team attacks. I.e. Barcelona defend in a 4-5-1 but attack in a 2-1-2-2-3 (that may not be completely accurate, but it serves my point.)
More than just formations
We all know that the formation you select sets the tone within a tactic, but it isn’t the most pivotal part. That title lands with your style of play. FMS co-owner, Johnny Karp, has created one of the most spectacular tactics I’ve seen. His 4-4-2 looks bland and boring to the untrained eye, but look a little deeper and you’ll see the detail and intricate play he aims to create. Each players role is set to keep a consistent pattern through each phase of play, so while Barcelona tend to change their shape drastically, Johnny’s tactic remains the same throughout. Meaning the entire team move forward as one unit and hold possession incredibly well. Barcelona hold possession but in a completely different way, they move around and are difficult to track whereas Johnny’s 4-4-2 leads to three steady lines moving forward for the ball to float along. However, the general style is that of Barcelona’s, short passing, and pressing high up the pitch, complimented by fluid and attacking movement.
Now, if Johnny changed his tactic to a more rigid and defensive mentality, what is the same formation would become a totally different tactic. To take this one step further, Johnny could adjust his passing to more direct and watch on as his team launch the ball up field as opposed to the short intricate game Johnny has become accustomed to. By changing three team instructions, we have transformed a beautiful, attacking tactic into a gritty old English style kick about. Just demonstrating that a formation does not depict what tactic and style of Football you play.
While Barcelona’s tactic looks completely different to Johnny’s 4-4-2 in shape, it looks closer in the match engine than I’ve seen anyone else come trying to use the same formation as Barcelona and copycat what they see from TV pundits and newspaper analysis. My point is your formation doesn’t depict how defensive and rigid you are, that is all controlled from the team instructions. Meaning you could turn a defensive looking formation/shape into something very attacking and risky with a few clicks of your mouse. But beware, as you must complete a complicated jigsaw including player roles to create an attacking, fluid tactic that doesn’t leak goals and player selection has a big role to play also. Why do you think I’ve always been so cautious with my tactics? ;)
More than just a player role
How many of you select a player’s role to suit his attributes? If so you are not alone as I fell into that trap myself. Picking one role to get the best out of a single star will not have the same effect as picking 11 roles to form a team unit. For instance, I’m sure Pedro and Villa of Barcelona would prefer to be played as the lone striker, but Guardiola sees them as instrumental to a bigger picture. They both tend to start out wide in order to offer their threat from the wings cutting inside and causing havoc. Add to this the fact that Barcelona’s formation can transform into a three man attack and you’ll see Pep’s thought process.
The same can be said for a central midfield three; the roles you hand out in midfield can transform a good tactic into an incredible one. And the beauty is all these roles should vary depending on your style of play. For instance, if you like to play a more direct style within a 4-5-1 formation, you’d be best organising your players into three categories, defensive, attacking and supporting. A poacher works well upfront so he can chase long looping passes and also wingers as opposed to wide midfielders to dart down the flanks. Your midfield three should be assigned three different roles, all to cover the previously mentioned categories and therefore each phase of play.
Now what happens if we switch this more defensive and direct 4-5-1 into a more fluid and attacking tactic with short possession play? Well I wouldn’t recommend keeping the same player roles; in fact I’d change almost all of them. Remember with a direct and more defensive tactic you have little creativity to force an opening so instead find the team making long searching passes and therefore stretching the game. When you switch to a possession orientated tactic these roles should be adjusted to bring players closer together and therefore offer passing options within every phase of play. There’s no point in playing a short passing style if your players are separated like in the direct style mentioned above because part of keeping possession is having options to pass the ball to like in Johnny’s 4-4-2.
Picture each player not as you see them in the formation, but as they’ll be within their role. You may have a striker all on his lonesome upfront, but assigning him the role of complete forward with support duty will see him drop back to fill in the space when required and therefore offering another passing option. That is just one example of many and you’ll see a pattern arise within my new tactic shown below.
‘The Manchelona’
While enjoying some great success with Newcastle United, I have started to feel frustrated by our balanced philosophy and as Johnny would call it ‘negative tactics’. Sure these win games when used correctly, but my usual 4-5-1 with direct passing style just isn’t that great to watch and I’m sick of researching every opponent to allow for their strengths and weakness’. I often found Newcastle finishing a match with less possession than weaker opponents and relying heavily on a swift counter attack. Having been a negative manager for god knows how many years, how could I change this?
I started by researching real life tactics, reading an excellent book entitled ‘Inverting The Pyramid’ and also testing Johnny Karp’s possession play 4-4-2. After spending a week or so with my head buried in books, TV and my trusted laptop I found the solution. Johnny has found an excellent tactic in his 4-4-2 and a bold one at that. It balances risk on a knives edge, but works in keeping possession and providing the right results. Unfortunately I’m not as bold as Johnny and decided to create something with less risk, but I believe it comes close to Johnny’s possession play while offering a little more security in defence.
To create such a tactic I took inspiration from two clubs, Manchester United and Barcelona. During the 2011 Champions League final we saw possession play dominate the more direct style of play, but that is not what inspired me to create a tactic around these two teams. Both are similar in domestic domination, but couldn’t be further apart in the way they play. While Manchester United has one of the most organised defences in Europe, Barcelona use their defence as a weapon in attack. On the same note United use a solid strategy and rigid tactic to hold the ball and also win possession back while Barcelona do the opposite to keep possession.
My plan was to use both these tactics fused together to make one unstoppable FM 2011 tactic that never has to be tweaked or adjusted for any opponent (well, 95% of the time anyway.) That’s right; I have attempted to use United’s industry, Barcelona’s flair and merge them for both a possession orientated tactic that also offers an ironclad defence. Was it successful? Well take a look below and download my new tactic at the end of this post. For anyone who still doesn’t get the tactics name let me spell it out. :) ‘Man’, for Manchester United and ‘celona’ for Barcelona. Fuse Man Utd and Barcelona together, then what do you get? ‘Manchelona’, cheesy I know! Well, I’m done blabbering so go to the next page and read about my actual tactic as well as getting the download itself.
Go to next page for explanation and download of ‘The Manchelona’
Johnny Karp
12 июля, 2011 at 12:49
Looks great Darren, from what I see the philosophy and the team instruction are similar to the ones I’m using so I might give this one a try. I think that the defensive CM is the key to this tactic, a good player there can make a big difference.
Darren Smith
12 июля, 2011 at 18:25
Thanks Johnny, it isn’t as good as your tactic for possession and domination…but you have to give up a little to gain elsewhere I guess. The defensive midfield role is important and that seems to be the bridge from defence to attack.
vaibhavc
12 июля, 2011 at 12:57
Wow! This tactic must work superbly with the big teams in FM and also the not as great teams, with your Southampton. I might just try this out.
Darren Smith
12 июля, 2011 at 19:17
Thanks mate, hope it works for you. The key comes in players for the right roles really.
Rich Wiltshire
12 июля, 2011 at 13:06
Hi Darren,
I’m loving the in depth analysis of the tatic. I like to think of myself as a «le professeur» meets «the special one» type manager in that I see the tatics as imperative and I endlessly search for players who can play in the roles I need rather than buying an outstanding player who won’t fit in and changing a tatic to suit. (for example I like Complete Forwards up front and tend to look for fast strikers with decent crossing abilities to play in the inside forward role after some positional training. I wouldn’t ever buy a fast striker to play upfront if he doesn’t have decent heading and creativity no matter how good a goal scorer he is)
My main formation in my current West Ham game is very similar to your Mancelona, but makes use of the Nike style defence so that I have a full back who drops into the hole on the wing when my inside foward drifts into the box. I’ve found that I can get a fair few goals from the full back picking up the second ball when an attack breaks down and whipping in a cross (an attack minded full back with good crossing works wonders for this)
Anywho now I’m rambling, but I just wanted to say thanks for the post its really helped me focus on why my formation works (Although I do have three formations to cover different situations I tend to stcik with my main one the majority of the time).
Be interesting to see how you get on with this new one
Darren Smith
12 июля, 2011 at 19:16
Thanks Rich and your welcome, I’m glad the post helped you see a few things within your own tactic. I also agree about the full backs and in addition I find they can stop attacks much faster by been higher up the pitch but obviously require great pace and mental attributes to avoid any mistakes. I hope this tactic continues to work for me but we’ll see the result when I finally reach the end of this season and some finals. :)
Mikey
12 июля, 2011 at 14:17
Hey Darren,
great post. Especially the depth analasys of player roles and atributes that they need.
I have a question. Do you change your tactic when playing outside home or facing top opponents in CL or PL?
My LFC tactics (as you maybe saw in posts under Sanogo article 4-2-3-1 with 2CMs and 3CAMs) started to do very well as I finally find a formula about how to make my lone striker to score. This was the main problem of not winning titles in PL. But when I play for example Arsenal (hate this guys — no other big team is causing so many problems and exposing my defence that much) I have to adjust the defensive line — drop deeper and starting strategy from control to standart and maybe also change the closing down from press more to stan out. So long story short I can’t use the tactic all the time. The shape, roles remain the same but the rest I’m adjusting.
So back to my questions. Do you adjust your tactic? Or using the same?
Darren Smith
12 июля, 2011 at 19:07
Thanks Mikey, I don’t change my tactic for anyone. The only time I’d change is midway through a match if the situation warrants it and things aren’t working or we have a decent lead away from home I want to protect, but even then, I only tweak it slightly to counter strategy really.
The key to these tactics are the same as Johnny’s, ‘let the opponent deal with your threat, as opposed to you dealing with theres’. This is the complete opposite to what I used to do but it works just as well and I haven’t had to change stuff all the time like before. The most important part is to have the right players though, without a suitable team technically and in physique you may lose some of the bigger matches.
Mikey
13 июля, 2011 at 11:57
Thanks Darren..yesterday was testing day…I adjusted my tactics a bit after reading your post. So still playing with 2 MCs (ball winning mid and deep PM — Lucas, Nuri Sahin) and 3AMCs (att mid, advanced PM — main, advanced PM — Hazard, Pastore, Steve G) and lone striker (target or advanced depends who is there Suarez/Carrol) and I also changed CBs roles to limited def, tactics went to fluid attacking and …so far played 5 matches with mid table team and it went pretty well…at least 3 goals scored every match and one conceded…now I have qtr. final of CL with Inter so will see how it works with stronger teams..anyway I really think it helped me so thank you.
Darren Smith
13 июля, 2011 at 12:31
Your welcome mate and good luck against Inter, hope that goes well.
Mikey
14 июля, 2011 at 15:07
Darren so it’s working :) so far…played Inter at Giussepe Meazza end up 2:2..I was losing till 75th minute but we’re palying till the end..then 1:0 beating Arsenal in FA, Inter home…peace of cake..3:0 and then Chelski at home…5:2 :) then I had to go to work..at least with good feeling.
All with the same tactic.
So thanks for the insights. Have a nice day :)
Darren Smith
14 июля, 2011 at 19:32
Great stuff mate, glad to hear it. :)
Daniel
12 июля, 2011 at 14:34
great work but one problem ur Football manager ego seems to be getting out of control lol
Sears
12 июля, 2011 at 16:22
I don’t agree with you, sorry.
Darren Smith
12 июля, 2011 at 18:23
Hmmm, you don’t half come out with some controversial comments publicly and via email. It’s tough to know if your joking or been serious sometimes. If you were joking then that went a little far and if not, well you can consider yourself off the scouting team. I only work with people I trust and if that comment wasn’t a bad joke, then I don’t trust you.
Daniel
13 июля, 2011 at 00:49
Don’t worry i was joking. What kind of controversial stuff do i come out with through email. I know I can be a controversial person sometimes but I didnt realise i did it that often
Darren Smith
13 июля, 2011 at 12:25
I’ll be honest Daniel, its just how you are I think. I am great at adjusting to peoples humour and when I do giving as much as I get. But there is no such thing as humour on the internet unless its blatantly obvious that is what it is and not a serious comment. I believe you are joking a lot of the time, but sometimes its hard to tell and when that happens, it doesn’t look great.
I have a very weird sense of humour myself, but adapt it while chatting over email and commenting because you have to consider how certain stuff may be read. You can read a sentence and take offence but to hear you may found the tone mocking and messing around….if you see what I mean.
Daniel
13 июля, 2011 at 13:03
yes I understand.
CsAtlantis
12 июля, 2011 at 15:14
Wow that is some arrow overload, a player like Arturo Vidal could make the difference in the tactic of yours
I’ve had a good degree of success with Arsenal using a similar shape, with nearly everything similar except default creative freedom, and using a box to box(wilshere), advanced playmaker(fabregas), and ball winning midfielder(song), and two wingers (menez and walcott)
I’ll give this tactic a try with my birmingham team, might be more solid that the 4-2-4 i normally employ :P
Darren Smith
12 июля, 2011 at 18:31
lol, yeh must admit I made that screenshot and then realised just how many arrows there were :)
I have found the tactic a success so far, but like all of them, it weakness’. Your 4-2-4 sounds very attacking lol :)
CsAtlantis
20 июля, 2011 at 02:14
Okay since I am in pre-season I am going to replace my somewhat bog standard 4-5-1 :D, will tell you how it goes…….
Darren Smith
20 июля, 2011 at 11:55
Cool, hope it works well for you mate.
George Dobson
12 июля, 2011 at 16:27
good tatic Darren I will try and use it in my Rangers save
Darren Smith
12 июля, 2011 at 18:26
Thanks George, I hope this helps.
Stromson
12 июля, 2011 at 18:20
Fantastic write up Darren, I was really looking forward to this. The tactical aspect of the game (both in FM and reality) fascinates me, and I love to read as much about it as possible. You’ve created what appears to be a very sound replication of the overall Barcelona strategy with a touch of Fergie to keep things defensively tight.
Since you seem to have done a healthy amount of research into this, I’m wondering if you have any book recommendations on the subject.
Darren Smith
12 июля, 2011 at 19:21
Thanks Jon, glad you liked it. I still have my biggest test to come for this tactic and thats the Champions League, win in Europe and I think its golden :)
I’d recommend reading ‘Inverting the Pyramid — a history of football tactics’. Its a fantastic read and really opens your eyes to the way tactics have developed. Even over the last 15 years or so we have taken giant leaps and that book inspired me to make a longer than usual post.
tonbridge plasterer
12 июля, 2011 at 19:41
great read thanks for taking the time gonna have to try this with my arsenal team should work we are barca-lite
Darren Smith
12 июля, 2011 at 21:32
No problem, hope it helps.
Daire Breslin-deane
12 июля, 2011 at 23:59
Hi Darren, very good post.
I tried the tactic in my Liverpool save (we were playing Leicester in FA Cup), and we only won by 2-0, but we had 36 shots compared to Leicester’s 0, and we had 66% of possession. Although we were playing an easier side than Utd, Arsenal, or Chelsea, it looks like it can also be very effective against the bigger teams.
We had most of possession, like Barca, and we attacked lke Utd. It’s a brilliant tactic!
P.S You said in your post that «Man» was for Utd, and «celona» for Barca, but shouldn’t it be «Manch» for Utd (MANCHester) and «elona» for barca (barcELONA) ?
As per usual, a very good post.
Daire
Darren Smith
13 июля, 2011 at 12:22
Thanks Daire, glad the tactic works for you and hopefully will continue to do the same.
As for the post name, its all the same to me lol :)
Kevin
13 июля, 2011 at 09:43
Hi Darren
A monumental post to be sure which must have required hours of research whilst sat on the beach :) Anyway, superb detail and analysis — one of the best I’ve seen over the years and thanks for making the effort and sharing it globally. I’ve downloaded it to perhaps try in a Test Save at some point. Great job!!
Darren Smith
13 июля, 2011 at 12:30
Thanks for the kind words as ever Kevin. It take some time to work on and the post was as long to write as the tactic was to test :) Hope it works well for you.
vikingmarius
15 июля, 2011 at 11:39
Fantasitc post Darren and you have a very interesting new tactic and can’t wait to see how it does, I would use it with Woking, but I play with two up front and lack some of the same calibre players as you, but anyhow great work and I love the detail
Darren Smith
15 июля, 2011 at 12:21
Thanks Viking, just a side note in the calibre of player isn’t as important as having good work rate, passing and technique. If they have those, you may be able to try it. :)
Sears
21 июля, 2011 at 00:23
Heyyy pal,
just wondering, who did you test this tactic with? I’m gonna test it with a few teams, beginning with Man City ;-p I’ll let you know how I get on!
Darren Smith
21 июля, 2011 at 11:50
I just tested it with Southampton then made my slow progression towards its full form with Newcastle. Tbh you should try it with technically gifted teams like City, Arsenal etc. But it is designed to work on more than one level meaning different levels of football too.
vintage
21 июля, 2011 at 14:52
do you play with 10.3
and do you use OI ? thanks a lot
Daniel
21 июля, 2011 at 12:30
hey Darren, great write up mate.
Ive been struggling in League 2 with Eastleigh, taken them there from Blue Square South, and want to know if you think it will work with a lower league side? Ive made sure i bought in the right players matching your positions too
Darren Smith
21 июля, 2011 at 18:37
Hey buddy, thanks for the kind words. To be honest I think this tactic is best with a solid defence that’s pacey…mainly because of the high defensive line. You don’t have to have incredible players, but having more speed and technique than your opponent does (meaning it can be used in any league) will prove important. I used it to ridiculous effect with my Newcastle team and also made a test save with Southampton in which I finished the season unbeaten and also beat a few EPL sides in the League Cup. Certainly worth a go mate. I haven’t tested it in such a low league, but reckon it could prove effective.
Daniel
22 июля, 2011 at 01:36
Alright thanks, also can you provide specific attributes needed for each position if thats alright, i have a basic idea, but would much rather you tell me haha
Darren Smith
22 июля, 2011 at 18:57
There aren’t any specific attributes required as such mate. Just as I’ve written in the post. Near the player roles I have explained what is important to each role.
vintage
21 июля, 2011 at 14:16
dear sir i will test your tactic with aston villa
i have 2 questions
does it work with 11.3
do you use OI during the game
Darren Smith
21 июля, 2011 at 18:40
I have tested this on patch 11.3 and finished my first season with Southampton unbeaten alongside a great League Cup run so it works with the right players. If you build the players around this tactic in terms of pace, technique and a deadly striker then you’ll do well. Just note it may take a little time for the squad to adjust but not too long I hope.
I’m not sure what you mean by OI, can you please elaborate?
vintage
21 июля, 2011 at 19:43
thanks for your answer
like Villa is not big team
in the game against bigg four should i change offense by control ?
OI is opposition instruction
do you use them ? do you ask to your assistant opossition instruction ?
Darren Smith
21 июля, 2011 at 20:02
No problem Vintage, the point of my tactic is to maintain possession and make the opponent deal with your threat before you counter theirs. Hence you shouldn’t change your starting strategy. You want to be aggressive. Fair enough you may lose against one or two big teams but I’d try leaving things as they are first and see how it works for you…this tactic is about the movement within each position so even while using attacking strategy the player roles should help the back four out anyway. Your only issue comes with slow defenders.
As for OI, yes I do use them. I check my assistants info and do what he says. But only while away from home or against the top four. Never use the OI at home against a team below the top four as your side will get bogged down on defensive duties as opposed to attacking so much.
vintage
21 июля, 2011 at 20:16
ok thanks a lot i will try i give you my feedback after 6 mounths of game
do you use touchline comment? like retain possession ?
Darren Smith
21 июля, 2011 at 20:35
Nice one, I’d love a little feedback…I know it works for me but would be great to see how others manage.
I always use touchline shouts also. Generally ‘retain possession’ and ‘get stuck in’ when we’re been pressured. Then ‘get the ball forward’ and ‘get stuck in’ if we aren’t getting enough chances against smaller sides. I also switch to counter when we gain a two goal lead and shout ‘pass into space’ and ‘hassle opponents’ but only if I’m worried about conceding.
vintage
21 июля, 2011 at 20:52
ok thanks a lot really i give you my feedback quickly
Daniel
24 июля, 2011 at 13:40
what do you do darren, if your team gets into a rut of bad form?
Darren Smith
24 июля, 2011 at 15:46
To be honest mate I haven’t had my team in a major rut with the Machelona yet. We’ve always drawn or lost the odd game but its never lasted for more than two games. I guess you just need to be careful with your team talks and demand more from them when the time is right and even be overly nice if the occasion calls for it.
Daniel
25 июля, 2011 at 11:10
alright mate sounds good, what teeam talks do you usually employ?
Darren Smith
25 июля, 2011 at 11:47
I usually use ‘do it for the fans’ if I expect to win, or ‘you can win this’ for matches that are looking more like a draw. But this depends on your teams morale and form. Ask your assistant what he thinks then you’ll see over time what works. There are so many different scenarios to effect team talks and that is why no one does a guide on them…its impossible to be right every time.
Daniel
27 июля, 2011 at 06:08
what opposition instructions do you do darren? I ask my assistant but i notice when i use the OI that our performance is a lot worse
Darren Smith
27 июля, 2011 at 11:41
I use the OI but only for difficult games away from home, I don’t use it at home. And even when I do use use it I only select two different instructions for two players. Anymore and the players get bogged down with defensive duties and lose something in attack.
Horace
26 июля, 2011 at 12:15
Hi Darren, finding the tactic very inconsistent, I’m winning 3 then losing 3, I have the right players, what could it be? It’s quite frustrating
Darren Smith
26 июля, 2011 at 18:49
I honestly don’t know what the problem may be. All I can think of is your team talks, how do you usually approach them? Failing that I could tell you how to give me your save to do some testing on.
Horace
27 июля, 2011 at 05:16
okay mate, i use wolfsongs team talks generally. do you want my save to test? This tactic is not the one you speak about in the FM handbook is it? Should i follow the suggestions you make in that( Eg. the starting strategy and so on)
Darren Smith
27 июля, 2011 at 11:39
This tactic was newly formulated as an alternative to what I mention in the handbook, its attacking with possession play whereas my handbook tactic is much more cautious so you could use those strategies if you’d like…they may be more suited to the lower leagues
tommy
29 июля, 2011 at 20:01
Sorry… But I dont understand how to download?
Darren Smith
29 июля, 2011 at 20:27
Go to the bottom of the 2nd page and click the ‘download’ image.
steffovic
29 июля, 2011 at 20:45
Im feeling so stupid right now… But I can’t find it? What second page?
steffovic
29 июля, 2011 at 20:48
Found it… :)
Darren Smith
29 июля, 2011 at 21:12
Nice one, hope this helps :)
steffe
31 июля, 2011 at 13:43
Hi Darren,
Just started a save with Middlesb. And I’ve been looking at both the Manchelona tactic and Newcastle 4-5-1/4-4-4
* What tactic would you suggest I go with.
* Any tips how and when to change the mentality in this tactics during matches?
I read your «How to beat al the Prem-teams…» but since I play in Champ. I don’t know how to use the information?
steffe
31 июля, 2011 at 15:32
Darren, ignor the post above.
I’ve tried a couple of matches and decided to go for the «Mancelona»-tactic.
steffe
31 июля, 2011 at 16:47
Playing Middlesb.
10 matches into the leauge
5W 2D 3L 15-12
I havn’t tweeked anything in the tactic. I don’t use any OI instructions.
So… to be honest. The results havn’t been that good.
I’m stuggling bad…
Any suggestions what to do?
Darren Smith
31 июля, 2011 at 17:08
All I can say mate is if the players aren’t right this tactic won’t work. You need quick defenders and technically gifted players going forward. You could either wait to see if your players settle into the tactic, bring in more suitable players or try the other tactic you mentioned earlier. It gets said a lot but when downloading tactics they won’t just plugin and work, you need to get the right players and play them in the correct positions. The Championship is a tough division especially in the beginning and if you don’t have the right players or funds to change your team you may need to think up a more suitable tactic to suit them.
steffe
31 июля, 2011 at 19:37
Darren,
Thanks for your quick reply. :)
I guess there are two main problems.
1. The team has not settle into the tactic yet.
2. I don’t have good enough players.
(Although, I have a better team then most of the other teams in the Championship)
But I like your opening post. I agree with everything you say, and the idea with the tactic is exactly how I want football to be played.
My thought is;
— Continue with this tacitc and hope the team settle better and better.
— Sign players more suitible.
— And also use Newcastle 4-5-1 in matches were it just dosn’t work…
Could you give me some advice on;
— When to change tactic?
— When to change strategy to control/counter a.s.o.?
— Shouts you use? And when you use them?
I know there’s alot to take in to calculation when deciding what to do.
But I would appreciate if you with your experience could give me as a FM-novice a little help.
Darren Smith
31 июля, 2011 at 21:12
OK mate, well I’ll try and answer those three questions as best I can.
— I can’t really say when to change tactic, as I’m a firm believer in keeping your tactics the same throughout…but maybe change against teams who have won five games on the bounce or are in the top five if you feel the need too.
— In the Manchelona you shouldn’t need to change strategy, but in the other tactic I’d use a standard strategy most of the time but change to counter for really tough away matches (in form sides and top five) and and when at home stick to a standard strategy unless you really fear defeat against the best teams in the division.
— A for shouts. If you’re struggling to score shout ‘get ball forward’ and ‘get stuck in’. If you have the lead and want to consolidate shout ‘retain possession’ and ‘get stuck in’. If you have the lead and the opposition are threatening then change to counter and shout ‘hassle opponents’ and ‘pass into space’. Now if you reach the last ten minutes and have a one goal lead change to contain and shout ‘retain possession’, ‘drop deeper’, and ‘play safer’. On the other hand if you reach the last ten minutes and desperately need a goal change to overload and shout ‘push higher up’. ‘take more risks’ and ‘get stuck in’.
I hope this helps mate. Also remember team talks are the most important part of the game. When expecting victory ‘do it for the fans’ and when you are away in a tough match with slim odds use ‘you can win this’.
steffe
1 августа, 2011 at 00:16
Once again. Thanks for your quick reply.
I tried this tactic with Liverpool just for fun. And you could se the difference at once. No question about it. You need good players for this tactic to work.
BUT! I also think you need a backup tactic. Even though you have a great team. Playing Man U, Man C, Barcelona a.s.o. is hard. Specially away.
As I said, I tried the «Mancelona» with Liverpool. But when I played Arsenel away, it worked better with «Newcastle 4-5-1» with strategy changed to Counter.
Darren Smith
1 августа, 2011 at 11:47
For a side that hasn’t been fully tweaked you will need to change the tactic I guess…but I’ve pieced together a had made squad for this sort of football (actually I made this tactic around my newcastle squad) and I win away and home no matter who the opponents. Though its unlikely you’ll build a side that quickly to use it all the time I guess.
steffe
1 августа, 2011 at 18:18
New day, and new questions… ;-)
My wingers?
Shuld I use Left footed on my left. And Right footed on my right?
Or is it better to play with there best foot inside?
Darren Smith
1 августа, 2011 at 18:41
I always use the wingers according to their favourite position and not what foot they prefer. So if a player is natural on the right wing, play him there no matter what foot he prefers.
steffe
1 августа, 2011 at 21:36
Glad to say that things are slowly getting better and better.
The team seam to settle more and more.
It took me half a season, but now I’m dominating most of the matches.
Playing some really fancy football and scoring quite alot of goals.
One thing Im impressed with is the good defense.
For such a offensive tacitc, the defense is very good!!! :)
But I have some things Im thinking of…
1. Why do the MC (middle) have «Long Shots = Often»?
— My MC has quite a good foot. But he keeps banging the ball into the stands al the time.
— Also Ive read somewhere that Long Shots isn’t something to recomend.
2. Sometimes it just isn’t working. Specially against teams that are playing with a low d-line and on the counterattack.
— Any advice what to do? Any shouts to use? OI to use?
And I have to say. This is just a great tactic! There are tactics out there that are just as good at getting the result. But I havn’t seen anyone that is so solid, and so close to football as it is played IRL.
Great work!
Darren Smith
2 августа, 2011 at 11:52
Great to hear you are finding success finally and thanks for the praise. This tactic is an acquired taste that takes patience and commitment to work.
1. As for the long shots that is only set for the def CM, I’d just take it off. I used it because of a players ability I wanted to take advantage of.
2. I personally have a team capable of overcoming those def line problems, but if you don’t I suggest using the other tactic we talked about with deep defensive line and counter attacking strategy, that used to work for me.
Hope that works.
Daniel
2 августа, 2011 at 10:13
hey mate, do you suggest setting the starting strategy as standard and then change to attacking? I find i concede first almost every time and only play well after half time when i tell my team im dissapointed. Im using the team talks you suggested but they dont seem to work, i always play poor in the first half and make barfely any ccc.
Cheers
Darren Smith
2 августа, 2011 at 11:55
If you don’t have the correct players then this could happen, you need a specific type of defence for this tactic to work and I’d recommend maybe changing to standard strategy in the beginning if you’re struggling…but don’t expect the same results as changing strategy will change the tactic completely. But as you say it maybe too attacking for your side.
Sam
4 августа, 2011 at 20:36
I have a few questions…
1. What about match preparations?
2. And Op. Instructions befor/during the game?
Darren Smith
4 августа, 2011 at 20:51
Both very simply answers really.
1. I set my assistant to take care of match preparations as he always does a good enough job so recommend the same.
2. As for opposition instructions, just do as the assistant says away from home and against really tough opponents. Don’t give instructions against easy teams or at home as you don’t want to bog the team down. Check back with your assistant at half-time for more tips and if you feel the opposition are threatening follow his further instructions.
vintage75020
5 августа, 2011 at 18:17
dear like last time i start season with villa
and
after 20 Games
10 win and 3 looses but lot of 0-0 or 1-1
i find there is not lot of ccc
most of game there are 1 or 2 ccs for me
Darren Smith
5 августа, 2011 at 19:10
Most of the time its a problem with the players mate, I found that with Newcastle I struggled for goals in the first season, but after signing Paloschi, Afellay and Gaitan we couldn’t stop scoring. I didn’t adjust my tactic but the players are far more important than the tactic you play.
pool-fan
12 августа, 2011 at 00:48
Been trying this tactic for a while now. And I’m puzzled.
I’m dominating Arsenal and Manchester City at home.
But loosing against Stoke and Newcastle away.
I’m playing Liverpool and I’m in my 5th season.
The squad is good. Not «worldclass al over» but good.
I’ve read the op-post. And I’ve read the questions and answers above.
From what I understand this tactic should work if you keep stuck to it, and get the right players.
But what I would like is a tactic to complement this one.
For us who dosn’t have just the right squad. And like me are struggling in some matches. For example away, and against very good teams.
For as I said. This tactic has been absolutly faboulus at home!!!
So I hope you don’t take this as critic Darren. I’m impressed with your work on this tacitc. But I do hope you take this as a challange to create a compatible tactic to use with this one.
Darren Smith
12 августа, 2011 at 11:51
Hi mate, well this tactic was actually created as an evolution in my Newcastle save. I used to use a more cautious and negative tactic that requires little tweaks for different opponents but I wanted something more attacking. Here is the link to that tactic https://www.footballmanagerstory.com/2010/12/fm-2011-newcastle-tactics-4-4-2-and-4-5-1/ (I am talking about the 4-5-1 with that post and not the 4-4-2.)
Also to back that tactic up I created a post on how I used to use it against every EPL side for the first two seasons, you can see that one here https://www.footballmanagerstory.com/2010/12/fm-2011-tactics-guide-how-i-beat-every-club-in-the-premier-league/
I hope that tactic will provide what you need mate, the problem with my Manchelona is the high defensive line. Against weaker opposition, if the manager is smart he will make the team sit back and defend deep with a DMC and then hit you on the counter…that is the weakness I’ve found with it anyway.
rolando
22 августа, 2011 at 15:45
Thanks for the tactic, been a treat in my Alfreton save, now up in Premiership, the only thing I had to adjust was that sneaky longshot option for the CM and complete revamp of the set pieces as I would concede half of goals from then. Otherwise, really great :)
Darren Smith
22 августа, 2011 at 19:31
Thanks mate, glad you like the tactic and its worked.
Mickey
2 сентября, 2011 at 21:42
The download link doesnt work can you email me a new one please? Cant wait to try it out.
Mickey
2 сентября, 2011 at 21:43
My Email address is michael.hunt43@tiscali.co.uk.
Thanks in advance
Johnny Karp
2 сентября, 2011 at 21:48
The link works mate, please try again: http://www.mediafire.com/?alcwstghysgy16o
Mickey
2 сентября, 2011 at 21:56
Hi Jonny, Thanks for the quick reply, I get this error when i click on the link?
HTTP 404 — Object Not Found
The requested URL was not found on this server
Am I doing something wrong?
Johnny Karp
2 сентября, 2011 at 22:01
I’ve tested it once again on a different computer and it does work, so I’m not sure what goes wrong but maybe it has something to do with your browser.
Johnny Karp
2 сентября, 2011 at 22:03
I’ve just uploaded it to another server for you, try this: http://freestorage.ro/50a2zi0clqi1
Mickey
2 сентября, 2011 at 22:07
Thought so, i am using google Chrome, second link has worked fine!!! JOHNNY KARP is now officially a legend in the Hunt Household!!!!!
Thanks once again and I will let you all know how i get on.
Adrian
3 сентября, 2011 at 11:26
Need help guys I’m a newb.
What if your staff says something like.. «Real Madrid seems to struggle when playing opponents with low defense line..»
Do you change your defense line or just keep it exactly the same?
Thanks in advance.
Darren Smith
3 сентября, 2011 at 14:17
That completely depends on the tactic you use. I have two, one is a very cautious 4-5-1, its plain and requires you to work at the oppositions weakness’ so while using this tactic I’d adjust my def line. However, I also have an extremely attacking and expressive 4-5-1 which concentrates on my teams strengths and I never change that one no matter what. Maybe consider the quality of your team also.
FCBfreak
24 сентября, 2011 at 22:04
Hey Darren.
IRL I’m coaching a team of under-13 years. Because of the board (Yes you can even have problems with the board at this stadium of football) we are playing in a league higher than what we should and have the talent for.
In our opening game against Glamsbjerg IF, we were murdered at home with a 0-13 defeat.(Of course with another trainer ;) )
But today we met them again away from home, and as i had my first match in front of this team i thought that it couldn’t get any worse and that it could be really cool if a FM tactic would work…
We did lose 4-2 but it could just as easily have been us who took the 3 points.
I just wanted to let you know as i feel like some of the credit belongs to you :)
Darren Smith
25 сентября, 2011 at 10:27
Always nice to hear such real life stories mate, thanks for sharing. I think SI make this game more and more detailed every year…part of this is making little tweaks and detailed changes in tactics count….so I don’t see why FM tactics can’t be adapted for real life. Hope your team overachieves and continues to play well.
Marcko
25 сентября, 2011 at 07:21
Hi Darren, I was just wondering how to create a tactic which is somewhat like how Liverpool plays under Dalglish (or how they SHOULD play under dalglish); some passing with one-twos to release someone down the flank, but not the short passing way that barca does (in other words more direct passing but w/o using long balls), wingers who hug the touchline and deliver crosses for the forwards rather than barca-style wingers, and things like that. any idea how to create it? thanks!
Darren Smith
25 сентября, 2011 at 11:09
Well that would take some tweaking and testing but I have created you a tactic in both 4-5-1 formation and 4-4-2, you can download both individually by clicking the links below.
‘Darren: Liverpool 4-4-2’ — http://www.mediafire.com/?5uuezufow853i0f
‘Darren: Liverpool 4-5-1’ — http://www.mediafire.com/?70bnbgmtgpd5h3j
Just save this into documents/sports interactive/football manager 2011/tactics
You should now load the game and look through your archived tactics for them.
While I set the passing to short to avoid the ball been hoofed forward which never happens, I did set the likes of ‘advanced playmaker’ and ‘wingers’ to pass very direct. That should capture the crossing and long range passing of Gerrard. All passing is focussed down the wings and wingers are set to hug the line and not cross before reaching the byline. You’ll need to test it as I don’t have time but hope this helps.
Marcko
25 сентября, 2011 at 13:52
wow okay thanks so much!:D
Darren Smith
25 сентября, 2011 at 13:59
No problem mate, I’m not sure how they’ll come out so do let me know :)
Marcko
30 сентября, 2011 at 11:40
okay i’ll try it out once i have the time! btw can these tactics be used for FM 2012 as well?
Darren Smith
30 сентября, 2011 at 12:00
I don’t see why not but won’t know until the games released.
Marcko
2 октября, 2011 at 06:14
Oh okay thanks! oh btw just checking but how do you manage both club and country at the same time? must you wait for a country to approach you? sorry i’m blur :P
Darren Smith
2 октября, 2011 at 09:18
No problem Marcko, as for managing an International side alongside your club its easy. You either wait for someone to make you an offer or show an interest in a vacant International job by applying for the position.
Marcko
3 октября, 2011 at 12:12
Ahh okay thanks! i’ll update you on the formation once i can play after exams (:
Marcko
15 октября, 2011 at 07:36
Hi Darren, its been quite amazing! the 4-5-1 has been really fluid, the 4-4-2 hasn’t looked as promising but is getting in the goals too! thanks so much!:D
Darren Smith
15 октября, 2011 at 12:29
Good to hear mate, just glad its working. :)
Miguel
28 сентября, 2011 at 12:56
Hi mate, I’m in a terrible run of form, I was top of the championship and now I’m 9th, havnt won in 10 matches. What should I do to turn this form around, currently I’m doing team talks as you can win this or for the fans if I’m expected to win. Any and all tips would be great. Cheers
Darren Smith
28 сентября, 2011 at 18:08
To be honest Miguel you have hit rock bottom there and I haven’t ever gone so low that I can remember. I’d suggest a change of tactics, players and maybe even try signing a few players on loan. Change is the only thing to help. If you are using an attacking tactic switch to something more cautious too.
Mikulas Nemeth
8 октября, 2011 at 22:09
Gonna try in my save with Liverpool, I took a job as a manager of my country Slovakia. I’ll give it a try…the only position I’m woried with is striker.
Darren Smith
8 октября, 2011 at 23:58
Well I hope it works for you mate, I actually adjusted this tactic a few times and made the striker a poacher instead of complete forward which worked well.
Mikulas Nemeth
9 октября, 2011 at 23:24
Well Slovakia has Stoch and Weiss on the wings, and Hamsik (in Barca in my save) with Kucka and som young CM..Defence is solid as well, attack is slow..but two friendly matches 2 wins score 6:0 …but weak opponents..will see :)
btw..just applied to my LFC team…and worked wonders in last two matches :)
Darren Smith
10 октября, 2011 at 12:13
That midifeld looks very talented actually and just a shame there isn’t more pace up front. Hope you can keep winning mate.
Bati
19 февраля, 2012 at 09:28
Hello, Mr. Darren
I would like to play The Manchelona, but with a 4-4-2 so I can make it up for Suarez and Carroll. Do you think it’s possible? Can you emulate the Manchelona using a different Formation? (4-4-2 would be nice) thanks!
Darren Smith
19 февраля, 2012 at 12:30
I’m afraid it would be a completely different tactic as this one is based around the 4-5-1 for possession reasons.
Pedro
22 апреля, 2012 at 12:23
Need help.. why i cant see the pictures that you post.. when I open it it says «Cant be loaded,try later»
Darren Smith
22 апреля, 2012 at 12:33
We recently have issues with our host and some image files were lost, I’m afraid those images will not be visible anymore but the issue should only have effected older posts like this one.
dodo31
3 мая, 2012 at 13:36
is it possible to have a possession-orientated tactic without such a high defensive line? My goalkeeper ain’t good at rushing out, not suited to be a sweeper keeper. It’s hard to find a cheap and good sweeper keeper! what’s the ideal pace attributes for the defenders?
By the way nice tactic! I wonder if we can use the a trequartista in place of the complete forward? Will it make a big difference? I want my striker to press opposition defenders and try to get the ball heheh.
Darren Smith
3 мая, 2012 at 19:15
I haven’t tested for any of that but it will all determent the tactic so not advisable to change…the point of the high defensive is more to close down the ball and launch counters higher up the pitch so using a deeper line could work but having a slightly slow keeper shouldn’t harm you too much. As for defenders they should have a minimum of 14 in pace IMO…obviously varies on the level of football you are at.